This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Joseph Smith article. This is not a forum for general discussion of the subject of the article.
Joseph Smith is a former featured article candidate. Please view the links under Article milestones below to see why the nomination was archived. For older candidates, please check the archive.
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Religion, a project to improve Wikipedia's articles on Religion-related subjects. Please participate by editing the article, and help us assess and improve articles to good and 1.0 standards, or visit the wikiproject page for more details.ReligionWikipedia:WikiProject ReligionTemplate:WikiProject ReligionReligion
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Christianity, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Christianity on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.ChristianityWikipedia:WikiProject ChristianityTemplate:WikiProject ChristianityChristianity
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Latter Day Saint movement, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Mormonism and the Latter Day Saint movement on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Latter Day Saint movementWikipedia:WikiProject Latter Day Saint movementTemplate:WikiProject Latter Day Saint movementLatter Day Saint movement
This article is within the scope of WikiProject New York (state), a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the U.S. state of New York on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.New York (state)Wikipedia:WikiProject New York (state)Template:WikiProject New York (state)New York (state)
This article is part of WikiProject Missouri, a WikiProject related to the U.S. state of Missouri. If you would like to participate, you can edit the article attached to this page, or visit the project page, where you can join the project and/or contribute to the discussion.MissouriWikipedia:WikiProject MissouriTemplate:WikiProject MissouriMissouri
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Illinois, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Illinois on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.IllinoisWikipedia:WikiProject IllinoisTemplate:WikiProject IllinoisWikiProject Illinois
This article is within the scope of WikiProject United States, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of topics relating to the United States of America on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the ongoing discussions.
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Politics, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of politics on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.PoliticsWikipedia:WikiProject PoliticsTemplate:WikiProject Politicspolitics
This article is within the scope of WikiProject Literature, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Literature on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.LiteratureWikipedia:WikiProject LiteratureTemplate:WikiProject LiteratureLiterature
This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history
Trim extended primary quotes, move to quote field in citations when possible
This is an article on a mainstream American religion, we need to make sure we don't butcher their teachings. I'm not an "in universe" expert like I was over at Roswell Incident. Need an editor with specialized knowledge to double-check.
Lede
Map has modern state boundaries -- a map without with 1840s boundaries would be better
Merge second great awakening into Western New York. Mention burned over district?
First Vision is complex -- two personages and 1820 dating isn't only version. Putting it early in lede makes it harder to understand where in Smith's ministry it became widespread.
All accounts are clear at Sept 21/22 1823 is a big date. Good. Unclear if 'angel' at this point, first known (to me) instance of deceased spirit called an angel.
Departures from Ohio and Missouri maybe split into two sentences? Recenter on Joseph
"anti-Mormon" is extremely unhelpful, almost tautological in this time period.
IFF justified, mention unique theological teachings in lede? Eternal families & baptism for the dead, triune heaven, exaltation & Adam-God? All seem more important that an 1810s crop failure.
Early life
"Smith's parents disagreed about religion" mention Lucy was the Presbyterian, Joseph Sr. was the universalistic (or whatever RS said)
First Vision interpretation relayed here (2 personages ided as God the Father and Jesus) is anachronistic to point in the narrative, not sure precisely what to do about that atm, def belongs here in the narrative
"Smith was said to have an ability to locate lost items" -- we know who started this claim, and it wasn't Joseph, it was Luman Walters. Should we mention? On one hand, don't want to give UNDUE weight to harmless treasure hunts which were very common, on the other hand, helps make it clear the role of seer was thrust on him.
Move seer reputation and treasure seeking to to before first learning of golden plates. Treasure digs clearly precede Sept 21/22 1823.
Gotta mention Alvin's exhumation about here, so Smith's departure from the PA Methodist class makes sense to readers
"The result of the proceeding remains unclear" We can do better. True we don't know precisely what happened, but Smith went free and returned to the county many times -- he was clearly wasn't imprisoned and didn't become a fugitive.
"Isaac Hale, objected; he believed Smith had no means to support his daughter. Hale also considered Smith a stranger who appeared "careless" and "not very well educated"" True, but also, failed treasure dig and animal sacrifices to appease evil spirits?
"last visit" really?
Merge with "he said he recovered"
"Angel commanded", Jewish Indians, "reformed Egyptian'? Is that contemporary to fall 1827? check on this.
Founding a church
Mention the use of hat and stone in translation process
very minor issue: "rapid-fire translation" feels a little jarring in the text, both a little militaristic and anachronistic? polish someday
Navuoo
Poisoning claim
to be continued
First vision is shared early but depicted in final form. Need to unfold.
for editing convenience, using more headings than will likely be involved in final version. Will condense after sorting by chronology.
Whole section needs revision on tone with more RS commentary
Not sure views on black people and slavery merit this weight -- not innovation, Curse of Ham and pro-slavery were mainstream in milieu
'Temple' anachronistic to Ohio? "House of the Lord" instead?
Zion is section-worthy
Background on Universalism vs Restorationism and JS teaching? tie in Curse of Ham and other things JS inherited?
Obviously, there's a tension between the Life narrative and the Teachings narrative. I inherited this schism in what's already a GA, and it's mirrored in numerous other high-quality bios of movement founders. The advatange of such a split is to move more "in-universe" content to the later section so that reader can first learn a basic biographical skeleton of the subject. An argument could be made that the two sections should be merge, but at present I'm not seeing any neat integration in RSes between the two narratives of the form "because of event A, Smith taught doctrine B".
Three witnesses, Eight Witnesses, and why the ultimate split
Legacy
Move later, split from family
Elias in Kirtland, shift from 3rd to 1st person
Big picture: Contrast the three 'main' responses to Smith: Bushman, Brodie and the Vogel (and obviously, Brodie is by far the weakest in the RSes)
I'd add to this, though I'm sure you're already aware, that there's a whole load of primary-sourced material in the article, particularly in "Views and teaching". There are a few missing / broken references left too: Fielding (1957), Chase (2014), Brodie (1945) and some of the 19th century sources too. Best, Wham2001 (talk) 07:42, 29 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Absolutely. Primary sources copied from subarticles are essentially just reminders to go find better/best modern source on that topic. It's even possible final article could be cited to Bushman with occasional assists from Vogel. Feoffer (talk) 16:37, 29 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]
@Freedom759:, you tagged with summary "This is article is unbalanced and does not mention the reason he was killed nor mention the controversy between him or the US goverment". I sincerely don't know what you mean -- why was he killed and what was the conflict with the federal government? What material do you think is missing? Feoffer (talk) 01:25, 11 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry My mistake, I was talking about his presidential Campaign. I did not see that at the time and I sincerely apologize for the oversight. I will remove the banner at once. Freedom759 (talk) 19:42, 11 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]
White washing.The historical truth is that,Joseph Smith was an Isrealite of dark complextion like his people, the Negroes. My question is, in 2025, why does an organization like this still try to perpetuate the lie that Israelites are white?They are children of Shem,father of the other dark race besides Ham!He who is also Melchizedek,King of Salem. The Melchizedek Preisthood is the only prieshood that Christ recognizes on Earth and none of your churches! ~2025-43579-57 (talk) 05:53, 30 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I think you may be confused. This article is just a summary of reliable sources; They report Smith was a white American, not an "Israelite". Feoffer (talk) 11:19, 30 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]
level-4 vital article is rated GA-class on Wikipedia's content assessment scale.
.svg)
