Talk:Low German

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Archives

Archive 1 (Sept 2005 – Dec 2006) Archive 2 (Jan 2007 – Jan 2009) Archive 3 (Feb 2008 – Feb 2010) Archive 4 (June 2009 – )

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Vowel Chart

I have, at least temporarily, removed the following vowel chart:

The list given represents the phonology of the Plautdietsch dialect.

IPA	Description	word
monophthongs
i~iː	Close front unrounded vowel	hia
ɪ	Near-close near-front unrounded vowel	Kjint
ɛ	Open-mid front unrounded vowel	met
æ	Near-open front unrounded vowel	Kjoakj
ɒ	Open back rounded vowel	Gott
ʊ	Near-close near-back rounded vowel	Bock
y	Close front rounded vowel	Hüs
ʌ~ɐ	Open-mid back unrounded vowel, Near-open central vowel	Lost
ɜ~ɜː	Open-mid central unrounded vowel	ferhäa
ə	Schwa	schmäare
e	Close front unrounded vowel	Tän

Plautdietsch is a mixture of Low Prussian, itself a Low German dialect with Baltic influence, and Dutch that underwent further Russian influence as a minority language. It is so utterly non-indicative of the general phonology Low-German that having only this chart in a section on Low German phonology is worse than nothing.

Here is a vowel chart that was for Northern Low Saxon that was deleted for no apparent reason on 2009-10-16. I don't entirely agree with it, e.g. the long a as ɒː ~ oː seems wrong to me and the very conspicuous rounding of the short i is not mentioned; but in my mind, is a far better starting point. Said with all due caution, Northern Low Saxon is generally regarded as the most representative Low German dialect and it is not unreasonable to take this dialect as a reference:

Northern Low German (Low Saxon) dialects:

IPA	Description	word	meaning
monophthongs
i ~ iː	Close front unrounded vowel	hier, mi	here, me
ɪ	Near-close near-front unrounded vowel	Kind, ik	child, I
u ~ uː	Close back rounded vowel	Huus	house
ʊ	Near-close near-back rounded vowel	mutt	must
y ~ yː	Close front rounded vowel	Hüs’	houses
ʏ	Near-close near-front rounded vowel	Lück	gap
ɛ	Open-mid front unrounded vowel	met, Bedd	with, bed
e ~ eː ~ ɛː	Close-mid front unrounded vowel or Open-mid front unrounded vowel	geven, Tähn	to give, tooth
o ~ oː	Open-mid back unrounded vowel, Close central rounded vowel	hoog	high
ɔ	Open back rounded vowel	Pott, Bock	pot, buck
ø ~ øː ~ œː	Close-mid front rounded vowel or Open-mid front rounded vowel	över, œver	over
œ	Open-mid front rounded vowel	Pött	pots
ɒː ~ oː	Open back rounded vowel or Close-mid back rounded vowel	Saat	seed
a	Open front unrounded vowel	Katt	cat

Short vowels are slightly lengthened before nasals (m, n, ng) and liquids (l, r). The sequence /ar/ sounds like in Australian English; e.g. Karr [kʰaː] 'cart' like Australian English "car" [kʰaː].

Old Saxon in Holstein

Why isn't western Holstein included in the map called Old Saxon speaking area? Also, wasn't Old Saxon spoken in all of Holstein before the arrival of the Slavic people? 62.113.194.157 (talk) 13:18, 17 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

There wasn’t any language called Old Saxon before the arrival of Slavic people. Do you have a source for your other claim?—Ermenrich (talk) 13:21, 17 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The wikipedia page dedicated to Old Saxon includes all of Holstein in the first map shown in its page. Even if this wasn't true, won't western Holstein (Holstein, Dithmarschen and Stormarn) still be part of the Old Saxon speaking area? Considering the limes saxoniae ran through the middle of Holstein? 62.113.194.159 (talk) 13:47, 17 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"German Low German language" listed at Redirects for discussion

The redirect German Low German language has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2024 April 11 § German Low German language until a consensus is reached. Utopes _{(talk / cont)} 05:49, 11 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Ingvaonisms

The article has an entire section titled "Ingvaonisms" yet offers no explanation of the origins or meaning of this term, referring in the copy only to "so-called Ingvaonisms". Rgrayuk (talk) 09:25, 11 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Low Franconian

Hello @Ermenrich. The Wikipedia article on Low Franconian claims that just older literature considered the Low Franconian dialects to be part of Low German, which is no longer the case today. Since you are familiar with this area, I wanted to ask you whether Low German and Low Franconian are really discussed separately in modern literature. Best regards. ~2025-42755-48 (talk) 00:32, 24 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

To the best of my knowledge, they are indeed discussed separately.—-Ermenrich (talk) 01:09, 24 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Okay! Thanks. ~2025-42364-87 (talk) 01:41, 24 December 2025 (UTC)[reply]